the morality of nude modeling

I am an artist.
A painter to be exact.
I can understand what you are saying. I can "get" what you mean about your art form, but...

I feel that it is very important for me to let you know something about this. Nudity does not offend me, and I don't fear it like some may. When I was in college we had live nude models come into our class room, and I had to draw several pictures of them.

I definitely think that God's creation is beautiful. This is especially since we are made in His image...
...enough sugar coating.

I personally don't feel that nude modeling is appropriate. I would never enforce this opinion on anyone else, but I know a little of how the male mind works. My husband has enlightened me as to just how visually stimulated men can be.

I think that while to some nude modeling is art, but you have to understand that some may seriously and literally get off on it. Please pardon the use of that phrase, but it happens. I guess what I'm saying is that I understand why you feel that nude modeling is a part of you. I can relate to how it makes you feel, but personally I think some may not be able to handle it properly, i.e the "getting off" comment.

I do hope this is coming across the way I want it to. I really don't want to offend you, and please know that I accept you just the way you are. I can fully appreciate the artistic nature of what you do. I just vehemently hate pornography, and some may not be able to tell the differance. Some lump porn and artistic nudity into the same catagory.

That picture by your friend of the female anatomy was a bit shocking. I can appreciate it if I think of it as an abstract work, but literally I find it disgusting. I'm nothing if I'm not honest.

This changes nothing of how highly I regard you. I added you to my list fully aware that you posed as a nude model. I just wanted to share my opinion on it.

The response:
I have indeed thought about all of that. To me, it boils down to this: if I thought it was wrong, I should obviously keep it to myself. And if I really think it is right and beautiful, then why would I hide it? I know that I am not responsible for anyone's choices except mine, and if a man sees a nude photo of me he has a choice -- to lust or to see the beauty of the human body. And I am not responsible for which choice he makes. Some will argue that a man 'can't help' but lust when he sees a photo of a nude woman, but that's a lie. There is always a choice. The Bible says that there is always a way out of temptation.

There is a lie that is very prevalant nowadays -- the lie that men can't control their sexual impulses. Some use this as an excuse for porn and some even take it as far as to use it as an excuse for rape. A man is in charge of his reactions, and if he is weak then he is responsible for not allowing himself the temptation. That is one of the reasons that there is a warning when opening my photography page -- it allows men who know they are weak in the area of lust to stay away from temptation.

I believe my art is pure and beautiful and godly, and I refuse to hide it merely because it could possibly be misused.

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aubkabob ══╣loooove╠══
very well put. i believe that everyone has a choice, as well. i've also always been very adamant in my belief that people need to take responsibility for their actions, and saying that they don't have control over their sexual impulses is just an excuse, and a lame one at that.

says me, anyway.

i am glad that you will continue to pose, as i know a) the sheer joy it brings to you, and b) the sheer *artistic* joy it brings to me. it even makes me sorta want to do it one day, when i'm finally completely comfortable in my skin. (though part of me thinks that this would be a lovely way to become more comfortable...)
belenen ══╣shimmering╠══
Oh, for me it was a lovely way to begin becoming comfortable... back then when I first posed, I was soooo not comfortable with my body. It started me on the journey to the acceptance I now feel. Not that I'm perfectly accepting by any means, but I am eons from where I used to be.

As soon as I get phone service again (thursday most likely) I'm going to call you!!! Can you tell me a time when you'll be free for a while?
aubkabob ══╣╠══
i know i say this repeatedly, but hell, i see myself in a totally different light since before i met you, and you play a great part in that, thank you!

and i'm glad that you're not just continuing to pose, but are encouraging others to pose as well!
misemifein2 ══╣╠══
"I definitely think that God's creation is beautiful. This is especially since we are made in His image..."

I got to this bit, and what I thought is that bodies, nudity, is beautiful because it is natural (I say natural, believers say made by God, but I think we mean the same). Also natural is a response to it. I have the feeling that this person feels that sex is a dirty thing, maybe not consciously.

I think that everyone, or certainly most people, could tell the difference between nude modelling and pornography. I don't like pornography. Not when it is degrading.

She knows a little of the male mind from her husband, and I don't know whether she is right or not, that all men will look at a nude female and be more attuned to it as the image of a female (and to be, looking for a word here, like "judged" but not), rather than art. She might be right, but what puzzles me is the link, that she has not stated, between men looking at nude artistry and being aroused, and nude modelling therefore being bad. I do not see an automatic link between the two.

The other thing that bothers me is whether the objection would just be to young and beautiful, desirable (not saying that others aren't desirable, but you know what I mean), people being nude. As it seems to be a titillating effect she is worried about. I would like to know how she feels about general nudity, nudists, people who choose to live naked. As God intended.

Also, I am not sure about the science behind this, because men and women's brains do work in different ways in some areas, for all I know they might in this. BUT it seems very sexist to imply that men are less in control than women, and that women should cover themselves up in order to protect these brutish males from themselves. Back to the problem, if looking at a nude female arouses a man, what IS the harm? Why is this bad?

Trying to answer that, wondering what it is that is unspoken, I thought maybe she thinks that if men get aroused then they are more likely to go and take advantage of a woman. Now I would think that most people would find that very insulting- even if a person can't control their attraction, lust, whatever, then I think that most people have reason enough to govern it, and wouldn't go out of their mind enough to attack someone. (I doubt you'll be offended by this, but I certainly don't think any nude modelling, not intended as and with little resembelence to pornographic images, is going to have such an effect).

Possibly she is the type of person (or Christian, but I know it isn't confined to christianity, and you aren't all like this), who believes that lust itself, arousal, is wrong, sinful, something like that. Except within the "proper" boundaries. And therefore everyone should do their best not to provoke any lustful thoughts in anyone else, unless safely married. Which I happen to think is a very unhealthy attitude, but her personal opinion and belief, which is fine.

And the bottomline of it is there is a clear difference between art and porn. A huge difference.

Not that you need me saying this anyway, bel, because you know your own mind well enough. I know you've thought over it a lot and you wouldn't do it if you thought it was harmful. It is a beautiful thing in what is not always a beautiful world, and it may be corrupted in the minds of others, but it is corrupting no-one itself.

If the lady whose opinion it is reads this, this is just my opinion too, and I hope you don't find it at all insulting.
belenen ══╣shimmering╠══
It is a beautiful thing in what is not always a beautiful world, and it may be corrupted in the minds of others, but it is corrupting no-one itself.

Now that right there pretty much sums up my feelings. ;-) Very well-put!

As for arousal being wrong, I personally think that it is wrong for a man to deliberately lust after a woman (who isn't his wife) -- but I think that is HIS responsibility, not mine. If I want to walk around in nothing but a thong, that might be unfair of me but he could still avoid looking at me if he wanted.

As for why it's wrong, well, that is a complicated question. Basically I think that it's cheating on either his current or future wife, not to mention he's deliberately reducing the object of his lust to just that -- an object. Being attracted is one thing, deliberately lusting is another. And that is just my personal feeling/belief on that.
(Anonymous) ══╣╠══
belenen ══╣shimmering╠══
Re: Le Sigh.
Thanks for your very thoughtful comment! I appreciated it, especially since you took the trouble to re-type it! This part was my fav: If anything to do so screams a denial of free will, saying that there is no choice in life and therefore we must fear ourselves as nothing more than carnal, beast-like animals. I'm sorry, but I have a problem with that. Exactly! Free will is the whole point. ;-)

On my site, no I haven't put the photos back up yet -- I think I'm going to migrate my whole site (eeep!) and put them back up, but that will have to wait until the end of the month, at the very earliest, 'cause I'd be switching to a more expensive host.
Expect to find curse words, nudity, (occasionally explicit) talk of sex, and angry ranting, but NEVER slurs or sexually violent language. I use TW when I am aware of the need and on request.
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Expect to find curse words, nudity, (occasionally explicit) talk of sex, and angry ranting, but NEVER slurs or sexually violent language. I use TW when I am aware of the need and on request.